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Join us as we explore the journeys that have shaped successful professionals and uncover the insights that can help you thrive on your career path. Thanks for joining us.

Sarah Richardson: . Welcome to Flourish the podcast celebrating bold journeys, brave pivots, and the power of purposeful leadership in healthcare and technology. I'm your host, Sarah Richardson, and today I'm joined by Amie Teske, entrepreneur, community builder and founder of Echelon, a command center and consultancy that helps individual contributors and sales leaders in health tech sales roles.

Amie Teske: It's crazy. I know it's a small world. It's

Sarah Richardson: big, but it's so small. And you're in Kansas City, which I also love. I'll be there in October, and we've already set up some time for a nice group of women to get together for dinner. But until we get to October, I love your story about what you've done and how you've done it.

Amie Teske: The very short story is I just wanted to stop. Globe trotting. I wasn't even globe trotting that much. I wasn't going like overseas that much, but I had been in a role for several years and it was, I've always been the kind of person that's okay, well now let's do this.

Sarah Richardson: which is actually a testament to why you were able to learn from the first attempt and go back in 21.

So if you could share a bit about that journey as well.

Amie Teske: so when I first did it, I started an LLC top line advisory. It's still the name of the LLC today. And I did it for about six months until. In this kind of a role, I'm often brought opportunities to take on full-time jobs

versus be a, an advisor or a consultant.

And the answer is yes. And so I wanted it to feel more tangible because as a sales person or anybody in the corporate world, everything is so results oriented. And if it feels squishy, it's so easy to say, eh. Not now when the reality is it's a really hard freaking job in sales or in leadership, or just in corporate in general right now.

And there's a lot of people out there who want to help people do it more sanely, whether it's like an acute problem or just like somebody in your back pocket all the time. And so that's essentially what happened is I kind of created that environment and in the process of figuring out how to make things more tangible.

Have there been any that have really impressed you and like you always remember who are they? What impact did they have? I try not to make it like. Rose colored glasses or romanticized, like what impact did they really have, but what impact did they have? In the process of that, I kind of named the people that you guys named as Echelon because they stood the test of time.

They did some things right where you're remembered and that turned into this Echelon Award, which fast forward, 18 months from that, it turned into this communities command center where health tech salespeople can peer learn from each other.

Sarah Richardson: Well, the peer learning aspect is so important. It's something we advocate here at this week health.

And you can do multiple smaller ones. Tell us more about that aspect of how that fits into today's really continued gig economy.

Amie Teske: actually kind of fell upon it. So Echelon started as this command center, we don't cross company lines. Why not? We're like the only group of professions that really don't have an association of sort.

So let's solve for that. That was early 21 when I launched it more public, or excuse me, 24 when I launched it more publicly. And since that time, what's happened is without even promoting or soliciting in any way, I get salespeople who are like, Hey Amie, it looks like maybe you figured out how to monetize your

network or how to do multiple things versus working corporate.

I really just need. Some people to just kind of help me figure this out. That doesn't sound go to market work. That doesn't sound like, some of this stuff that is very researchy academic. It's like execution. And so this coming together, like this sole practitioner as you called it, is how do we take both sides of that equation and make it something that both can benefit from people who've been in it for a long time, monetize it, and then people who are trying to grow a company leverage experience.

And so in our world of this gig economy. I'm trying to take a lot of that and match, if you will, good experience with good company so that both can flourish. Well, and you're a bit of a

Sarah Richardson: gatekeeper because people come to you knowing that you will have the Echelon of the things that they are seeking.

Amie Teske: Most of us who have been in sales for a while, and this all started like in honor of sales. There was a time when we all really loved it and it's kind of gone away. Yes, there's disengagement. Yes, some companies are better than others and that's all fine, but when we all come together it's hard to take any of us seriously because we just, we like to kick back.

We like to have a good time and we miss

[Mic bleed]

We miss it. It's more like , the tribe, the culture, the social interaction, I mean, arguably cult you hear like cult is just short for culture. Like how do you bring this together, but in the positive way. There's a lot of laughing and there's a lot of just like deep breaths.

[Mic bleed]

Well, you create a

Sarah Richardson: safe space was one of the things you mentioned. Safe peer space. So you have to show up on stage when you're with your clients or with different customers, and yet when you have an authentic demand for a community.

You shared with me how it helps get rid of head trash, which I loved that concept. So when you have a safe space for high performers to get together to clear out head trash, that whole equation is not common. And so how have you seen the success build from that ability for people to unwind a bit while they're still building the best version of themselves?

Amie Teske: That's a puzzle, right? And it's constantly changing. So the way is create the space, right? Create the vehicle for people to come together. That isn't public forum. That is more private, which is why Echelon is more private and it's membership based. So that's one, because then you really get people in there who really value what

It's okay, let's get on the phone and we're really just gonna end this group. Talk through and if I don't have an answer or a question, I can hear other people are answering questions. So there's like this live interaction to q and a, to even people who are in roles. They'll get on and members will do a recording on this just works for me.

Sarah Richardson: And there's a draw to working for yourself or having the ability to serve multiple organizations as a solo practitioner, as an example. And yet if you do step away from the corporate wheel and decide to do something on your own, like what you have done, there's also a framework for success and sanity to a degree that has to exist.

You shared with me, Hey, it was great in the beginning, but then you have to have a schedule. You have to hold yourself accountable because the human connection outside of corporate structure is really important. How have you created that environment for yourself?

Amie Teske: Yeah, I didn't at first, which is how I learned it.

I really needed it. Like in the corporate world, we're so quick to be like, oh my gosh, another meeting, or I have to enter something in Salesforce, or I have, like all of these things that you're responsible for doing and we just curse it and part of it is because we lack the perspective of.

And a lot of salespeople were rebels. right We are some of the most evasive humans on the planet. When you get us out of the chase and that's what you just, you set goals, you don't hit them because you'll find all kinds of reasons to not. So what I have learned in this is I used to curse accountability.

I didn't wanna show up Monday, Friday and now it's like I have to have it to stay. Productive in reaching these incremental goals along the way, and I need to have it from somebody who will actually hold me accountable and not a friend.

And really important, if you're individual soul person

[Mic bleed]

Sarah Richardson: Well, and you stated that, freedom has to have boundaries to a degree. And that level of sort of accountability for yourself, how do people synthesize knowing their value as an advisor, as a connector, as a board member, when you go out on your own, people will often call me and say, what should my hourly rate be?

How do I know what to charge? Do I do a retainer or do I do hours, et cetera. What advice do you give to people in Echelon? To understand their value and how much to quote unquote charge for the things that they know and for their network.

Amie Teske: The best advice I can give is just start. And if you don't look back and laugh at some point in time you probably were too slow.

curious and a lot of people are. And so you'll get on the phone for 30 minutes or for an hour because you're just so curious about people and knowing. And then after a while you're like, okay, well that was. An hourly rate. That was when all of a sudden you're stressed because you're not getting the things done that you're supposed to get done, you start looking at it as an hourly rate and so you start telling people, and people value that and they respect it way more than individuals probably give that credit.

And people will pay because they know your time is valuable. It's a self-confidence thing. You just gotta get yourself to the point where. You are still connecting, but your time is valuable and then you'll end up working with better people too who don't take advantage of it.

Yes. You'd be amazed how many don't respond and that's okay. Mmmhmm

Because to your point, you've gotta be able to stay in the game and you love sales because of the hunt, the chase, the win, the camaraderie. What does a healthy sales environment look like and feel like when you are actively doing those four things?

Amie Teske: Oh gosh.

It becomes an energy all by itself. I. And I mean, I could throw all kinds of fancy words at you, like it's the intrinsic, it's the, I want to be here. It's, yes, there's a purpose, and yes, I'm fighting for something much bigger than myself and one plus one equals three and all those things.

they don't need to know all the details, but if they want the details, it's okay to give it to them. Right? There's this transparency that exists. So it has to be simple, it has to be certain. Those are really important points from. A culture perspective for sales as well as creating this energy and this liveliness.

One of the things that I press on a lot of people that I don't think gets enough airtime is recognition. And so if I spend just a few seconds on that recognition, isn't this attaboy thing. It's not Hey, good job for the core, basic of your job description. It's like you did something unique here, or something that is in line with our values here, or something that was above and beyond, or you exposed that this is a new persona that maybe we should be talking to because they actually care more than people that we're talk, recognizing people in ways that are public and specific to them that.

Your people are the ones who are selling. So as a leader, you have to go out there and figure out your people and that's a big part of making a

culture work I love

Sarah Richardson: that because when you know what specifically motivates people, how they like to receive recognition, in what format they wanna be heard as well.

It is such a powerful way to build that trust. Yeah. In the community, within the teams. 'cause to your point, growth is necessity for all organizations, but it's how you get people there in a way that builds the camaraderie that is so important. Keeping people motivated, building community, because that's a competitive field.

And let's be honest, sometimes sales individuals are to a degree, they might have their own territory, but they're still competing with each other for certain accounts, especially when they move around because they may be like, Hey, I had Amie in the southeast, now I live in the West. I still want Amie. How does an organization make up or assimilate for that?

Amie Teske: It really has. And there was a good period of time when I started Echelon. I think the fire that really instigated it was when I would have salespeople come to me and sales leaders individual contributors and leaders come to me and be like, I'm just done.

I'm just done. And then you ask questions around it. And a lot of it is just this constancy of numbers activity numbers. It just constant and all of us know, even institutional investment know that if you hammer on a number, like you're hammering on the wrong thing, you want the number, but you need the people to achieve the number.

And so we all grin and bear it. We all say, yeah, we got it and we're always willing to bet on ourselves. They're like, oh, you're like, all right, here's this huge number. And you're like, all right I'll bet on me. I think I can figure this out. And then, fast forward seven, eight years and all of us are like, okay, what's wrong?

Either I'm not hitting the number or it's inconsistent and then, throwing COVID and it's 52 card pickup and it's all the things. my opinion around institutional investment is that companies need money. And in order to capitalize on that money, there has to be a focus on

[Mic bleed]

And this isn't kumbaya. I always have to this, like this is not what that is, but. If you just keep pressing on numbers and don't focus on an activity number measures and so forth, you won't get the results. And so that's where I feel like there's a bit of an injustice for people who are in a sales growth, especially leadership role is.

[Mic bleed]

So there, there's this line between squishy and results, and I'm trying to help solve for it because we have to learn how to do it right when numbers will never go away. And I do have to say, don't get me wrong with this either, because I'm an extremely results oriented person.

If you threw a disc profile at me, like I'm a high D and I'm an I, right? Like just like gimme the frigging number, but there's a people part of this. You'll see me lean there in order to lever what I have to achieve the number. And I think that's the spot that we need to be in.

We just need more tools to do it, which is what I'm trying to help with

And it takes a village of all of it because if your team is all DI's, you are gonna have a different kind of problem on your hands and helping people assimilate into some of those spaces. So knowing how they function and operate. But there's also that space that says, okay, I've been doing this for 20 years and I want to do something different.

I wanna do what Amie has done. You're creating that environment for people. The, I think analogy of Legos being able to stack people's skillsets up in different areas of organizations that need it and they need it 10, 12, 20 hours a week. How do you match a 20 year veteran with a startup that needs expertise but doesn't have the budget for full time?

Right, and that can look very different customer to customer. A lot of people will talk about that in terms of do you already have product market fit? Do you have market message fit? Do you have, and those are just, I think that those are very academic. That's fine. Like it's important to understand that.

But there is a, you get a good sales person who has a network and has proven their stripes and sales. And then you get a company that has a really good product idea, has a bit of a beachhead, the right person in the wrong company is the wrong person. Right? And then vice versa.

Let's keep talking and getting it to a contract, John Hancock, and it's dried kind of thing. And so it just kind of depends on what the company wants and then the experience of the individual. And that just requires a lot of conversation. I'm trying to do things that make that more efficient.

But you can only do so much with a survey or give me your resume or look at LinkedIn because once it passes somebody like me, then it's, they gotta talk. They have to jive. 'cause if they don't jive, it'll never work

Sarah Richardson: And how do you. Get to a space where a person believes that they can on their own, as an example.

How do you help people reconcile their success in corporations To a success personally?

Amie Teske: Two things. One is you get the confidence by doing the thing. just gotta go do it. And there might be a couple where you're kinda like, Ooh, either that didn't work, or, Ooh, like an internship, right?

I didn't like that. Don't wanna do it. Right. You don't know until,

[Mic bleed]

And so the best suggestion I have is just call me. And there, there's probably a company out there that would love for you to just knock on a door and get them a few conversations and it doesn't have to go anywhere.

And then don't presume that it's going to be perfect the first time because you'll, kiss a few frogs along the way. And that's where something like a community like Echelon is really helpful because things that don't work there usually are people like, yep, happens, okay. Or maybe try this.

Right? Like that would be. Barring anything else. That's what I would tell people is you've just gotta try it in order to get the confidence.

Sarah Richardson: There's some essential first steps though. You don't just tell your boss, I've had it on Friday and Monday can be like, Hey, I'm gonna make up a shingle.

What do people need to plan for or think about before they just go off on their own?

Amie Teske: Yeah. So very good point. There are people who, like on the side, will they already, they still have corporate jobs. They will just talk to other companies and they're like, okay, what do you do? That's really cool.

That's interesting. And yeah, I'll go, open some

[Mic bleed]

[Mic bleed]

like full-time. They don't, it is truly not possible.

It's not possible because something will sacrifice and the people that I've seen try it. Something sacrifices so you have to really focus on it. So like the little steps are open some doors for some companies, right? Like you're already out there networking.

You already know these people. You're like, Hey, I heard about this company. You might be interested. Would you be up for a 30 minute conversation? I told them i'd help

[Mic bleed]

Right. You're already networking. That's not a hard thing to do. But if you do wanna jump in with both feet, the thing I would tell you is leverage people who have done it.

There are lessons learned. Know who those people are. Like there's several of us that, that's like the full-time gig that we do. We can help you with the tools, the kinds of things you should have, like how to set up kind of things. But it really is how to get your name out there. I would also tell people that don't do more than three.

Work yourself into the one or two that are really strong for you and then just keep going. Some of them turn into full-time jobs. Right. So it's just just try it out. But I would say start working on the opening door concept before you jump in with both feet, unless you just have some war chest of money sitting over on the side to pay your mortgage while you do this because it's hard.

It's hard. You will run through some that, you're like, okay, this isn't a fit. It's not for me. It's just not yet.

Sarah Richardson: Well, and I believe people show up differently when they're chasing the dime of, oh my. You can tell them people are desperate for the income versus. Not that it's never genuine, but the ability just to say, Hey, I've got a couple people, I'm repping a couple companies.

And those are the differentiation points you need to really consider. 'cause if you can't make it on your own, what the heck are you doing? Taking that leap of faith unless you have a backup plan or to your point, some kind of reserves that make it still fun and still worth the intent of what you did it in the first place.

Amie Teske: [Mic bleed]

And then grow from there.

Sarah Richardson: Yes. Yeah. Because it's scary. If you don't have a way to self sustain, no matter how great your community is I don't think your neighbor or your friend on the street's going to go and make your car payment for you as an example.

Amie Teske: Yes, and I always say you're the five people that you surround yourself with the most, right?

And so have a group of people that are just as ambitious as you, that you know are rebel enough as you, but have some experience to help you through as well. That becomes a really critical component of success here.

Types of connections where you say, is this a good idea? And if they say no, you're like, okay, I trust that group to tell me that was a that or that was dumb, or slow down or talk to this person. If you don't have the people that keep you grounded and honest, then you're gonna go off in 50 different directions.

Amie Teske: Thousand percent. Yes. And let's be honest for a second. We are like a whole bunch of six year olds running around in adult bodies. Like we are just, we are like, ooh, bright, shiny object, bright shiny, and we just, and we chase them because it's a bright, shiny object and it sounds really cool.

And it's more fun than the mundane stuff we have to do, right? So you have to, I mean, this isn't just like you, this is a human thing. You have to have people who ground you.

Sarah Richardson: And for all the people listening that they're like, okay, now you've just sparked this thing. Like they know it's possible.

What's the best way to reach out to you after having heard this conversation today?

It's, we're not the bike. Don't look for the bike. , This is under Amie tuske.com/Echelon. That's where this really exists. So reach out to me that way. And I would love to talk to anybody and everybody, and even if it's just what's going on in your sales world

Sarah Richardson: especially what's happening in healthcare and policy regime changes, et cetera. There's a lot of uncertainty out there and then having those conversations with other people going through it too. I'll give you perspective on all of those aspects. I have to go into speed round.

I have to ask you some very non-technical or non like tough questions if I may. Yes. Go. Okay. First concert you ever attended, crystal Gale. Seriously? Yeah. Were you like obsessed with her hair when you were a kid? Yes. You touched like the floor or the ground, you're just like,

[Mic bleed]

Amie Teske: Obsessed. More of just and like I'm pretty sure I just sit there with my mouth wide open.

Is that possible and why

Amie Teske: I feel like I have an addiction problem to apps. and every month I go and I look, I. And I'm like, why am I paying all this money for all these little apps? And it's delete, delete. I, I don't know, I think my favorite app right now, I, it's a love-hate relationship.

I think a lot of us have is I use Claude more than anything. So I'll go out there and it's a love hate because I will get sucked in. I'm like, I don't like that perspective. We're like, maybe I say it a little bit different and I'll spend way too much time. So I have learned how to like. Mm. Just use it for what I need to use it for, but that's probably my favorite.

Other than the phone app, that's still my favorite app of all time. I probably think, like on my phone, the actual phone, pick up the phone and talk to somebody.

Sarah Richardson: Although, do you find using whatever, whether you're using Claude Chat, et cetera, using the voice version, the conversational aspect of it, have you leaned into that yet?

Amie Teske: no, no,

No. And there're like, and there's versions that do, yeah, no. Like it can kind of, why imitates

Sarah Richardson: me and I'm like, I don't wanna talk to me. I wanna talk to you, but you're not even real.

Amie Teske: Yeah. You're like, what is, it's like this inception world wait, is this real?

What's not? Is there a spending dime somewhere?

Sarah Richardson: Because why? We just pick up the phone, actually call a human being when we're done fighting with our AI agent for sure. Morning routine must have.

Amie Teske: It's either a workout or I study something like I read a book. Every morning I have to, if I don't like, my whole day is for naught.

It really is like I try to get my work. The hardest part for me is that I would prefer to just get a workout in, but the best time of day for me, like my brain to get work done, like real, like focus, intentional work is before I even hear footsteps in the morning for my family. And so I just alternate. So like usually like Wednesday or Tuesday I'll, the workout will either be later in the day or I don't do it at all.

[Mic bleed]

Sarah Richardson: Do you ever double dip them? Do you ever throw the book on the treadmill and try to do both or do you focus on one task at a time?

Amie Teske: This morning I actually did exactly that. I couldn't decide I was indecisive.

I'm like, I'm just gonna do both. So I'm gonna walk and I'm gonna read and like I'm in the middle of this book that I just love. And

Sarah Richardson: so I'm like, I'm gonna do both. I sent a podcast to one of my girlfriends that I'm like, you're gonna love this. And so she's like, this morning she's I ran all 45 minutes because of the podcast you sent me.

And it was a 45 minute listen. She goes. So I think I'm grateful, but I'm also kind of like, why did you make me run so far today? I'm tired. I'm tired, but thank you for me being smarter because of it. Last question, what does flourish mean to you in one word?

And so to really flourish and to take that deep breath on a given day, it usually means that you're confident about something that you've done or you're in process of doing. And there's a lot of freedom and space in that.

Sarah Richardson: When you say self-confidence enough to love yourself first. I truly hope that's what everybody takes away from listening to these episodes. And thank you for being on the show today.

Amie Teske: Thank you, Sarah. I love it. Thanks for having me.

We hope these stories catalyze inspiration within you, propelling you forward in your own career odyssey. Stay connected, stay curious, and keep flourishing.

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